Katz: C7 looking to add Richmond?

[whiteandblue77]

Marquette sure did. If I recall that next class or two was a nice jump in quality and number of applicants. The school was trending up at the time, though.

How much did that have to do with the release of Tommy Boy? Hmmmmm?

[thegalen]

All schools have to disclose spending due to Title IX:
http://ope.ed.gov/athletics/

That reporting though allows for several loopholes

Right, so non-issue. Just pointing that out to the OP who raised the question.

There are a whole litany of other issues outside the legal arena when you have one public school in a conference where all of the others are private schools. The culture is obviously going to be significantly different, as is the mission and academic and admission standards.

Ok, so name them. We've touched on FOIA (again, how many times in the past was the BE burned by FOIA via the publics? anyone?). We've touched on Title IX disclosures, another non-issue. Let's look at median admission profiles:
VCU: 3.6 GPA; 1,111 SAT score (math+writing)
Seton Hall: 3.4 GPA; 1,100 SAT score
SLU: 3.70; uses ACT, but a composite conversion is around 1,200
Butler: 3.51 - 4.0; 1,170
Xaver: 3.5; 1,111
Dayton: 3.6; 1,170
Providence: 3.37; 1,155

I could go on, but point being, these schools aren't starting a study club or a research consortium. They left for one reason: money. If there's a second reason, it's basketball. Unless a candidate school is a major academic outlier, it will NOT be a factor.

[thegalen]

Like Bluejay said, "long term advantage" of schools on the same path. VCU has a great program, but it's not going to happen, sorry to say.

Don't bet on it. Or do, and I'll sell you some points. The NBE has 1-2 years to reach "escape" orbit and not be thought as the A10+. I can guarantee you that the weight being afforded the private vs. public question on this and other message boards reflects parochial fan concerns and NOT the business decisions driving this process.

[SixTwentySix]

Like Bluejay said, "long term advantage" of schools on the same path. VCU has a great program, but it's not going to happen, sorry to say.

Don't bet on it. Or do, and I'll sell you some points. The NBE has 1-2 years to reach "escape" orbit and not be thought as the A10+. I can guarantee you that the weight being afforded the private vs. public question on this and other message boards reflects parochial fan concerns and NOT the business decisions driving this process.

I can certainly agree with this, and I have no issue with a public school. I just want to see a solid conference. I would be more than happy with VCU in the conference and think they could be a great fit, so you don't have to sell me on anything. I just don't think it's going to happen even as a business decision. I have read quotes from AD's and Presidents and other people from within the decision making that have mentioned Xavier and Butler. I've heard them reference St Louis. And I've heard two schools that want Richmond (Gtown and Nova). I haven't heard a peep about VCU from within, everything I've read comes from fans and forums. Again, this is only what I've seen and read, I'm not saying it doesn't exist.

I'm on these forums to expand my knowledge and get ideas. I'm not hear to say "This is how it's going to be. The rest of you are all wrong". I'm just sharing my opinion and how I've come to it. Would love to hear from everyone else.

[yorost]

There are a whole litany of other issues outside the legal arena when you have one public school in a conference where all of the others are private schools. The culture is obviously going to be significantly different, as is the mission and academic and admission standards.

Ok, so name them. We've touched on FOIA (again, how many times in the past was the BE burned by FOIA via the publics? anyone?). We've touched on Title IX disclosures, another non-issue. Let's look at median admission profiles:
VCU: 3.6 GPA; 1,111 SAT score (math+writing)
Seton Hall: 3.4 GPA; 1,100 SAT score
SLU: 3.70; uses ACT, but a composite conversion is around 1,200
Butler: 3.51 - 4.0; 1,170
Xaver: 3.5; 1,111
Dayton: 3.6; 1,170
Providence: 3.37; 1,155

I could go on, but point being, these schools aren't starting a study club or a research consortium. They left for one reason: money. If there's a second reason, it's basketball. Unless a candidate school is a major academic outlier, it will NOT be a factor.

I don't think VCU is necessarily getting dissed as a poorer institution, there, they look like a pretty nice addition academically. Different standards doesn't have to mean quality of students, that same statement would apply to UW-Madison or Michigan vs the BE7.

[thegalen]

There are a whole litany of other issues outside the legal arena when you have one public school in a conference where all of the others are private schools. The culture is obviously going to be significantly different, as is the mission and academic and admission standards.

Ok, so name them. We've touched on FOIA (again, how many times in the past was the BE burned by FOIA via the publics? anyone?). We've touched on Title IX disclosures, another non-issue. Let's look at median admission profiles:
VCU: 3.6 GPA; 1,111 SAT score (math+writing)
Seton Hall: 3.4 GPA; 1,100 SAT score
SLU: 3.70; uses ACT, but a composite conversion is around 1,200
Butler: 3.51 - 4.0; 1,170
Xaver: 3.5; 1,111
Dayton: 3.6; 1,170
Providence: 3.37; 1,155

I could go on, but point being, these schools aren't starting a study club or a research consortium. They left for one reason: money. If there's a second reason, it's basketball. Unless a candidate school is a major academic outlier, it will NOT be a factor.

I don't think VCU is necessarily getting dissed as a poorer institution, there, they look like a pretty nice addition academically. Different standards doesn't have to mean quality of students, that same statement would apply to UW-Madison or Michigan vs the BE7.

Right, just pointing out that there's this fantasy that the C7 all have Georgetown's admissions standards and somehow there'd be a competitive advantage to letting in public school's that are head and shoulders above the likes of Lousiville (maybe 50% of their players graduated kindergarten?). The idea is that lesser academic schools would bring in high-major talent that otherwise wouldn't qualify at a the better peer institutions. That just won't be the case. I don't care about the quality of the broader student population and neither does Fox or anyone calling the shots unless, like I said, there's some kind of an extreme outlier in the mix. And there isn't, so any talk about admissions or academics is just way overblown considering all the schools are within range of another. Really, the litany of "reasons" the OP referred to isn't much of a litany at all when it comes down to it, and that's what I was noting.

[thegalen]

Like Bluejay said, "long term advantage" of schools on the same path. VCU has a great program, but it's not going to happen, sorry to say.

Don't bet on it. Or do, and I'll sell you some points. The NBE has 1-2 years to reach "escape" orbit and not be thought as the A10+. I can guarantee you that the weight being afforded the private vs. public question on this and other message boards reflects parochial fan concerns and NOT the business decisions driving this process.

I have read quotes from AD's and Presidents and other people from within the decision making that have mentioned Xavier and Butler.

Maybe I haven't been paying as much attention, but here are the schools I have actually heard name checked by any AD, any President, or any official affiliated with the C7: Butler, Xavier, and VCU.
http://espnwisconsin.com/common/more.ph ... t_id=16611 (ctrl-f Butler, VCU)

There's definitely a lot of message board chatter and endless recycling of ESPN "sources" and all manner of blogs claiming this and that, but I don't think any of it amounts to much.

[SixTwentySix]

Like I said, I'm here to share and learn. Thanks for the link!

[yorost]

For the record, he doesn't actually say Butler in that article. He just hints at an Indiana school that plays good basketball. There was a later article dedicated to him saying Marquette wants Butler in.

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/goldenea ... 11521.html

That also indicates a gag order regarding everything might be in affect.

[thegalen]

For the record, he doesn't actually say Butler in that article. He just hints at an Indiana school that plays good basketball. There was a later article dedicated to him saying Marquette wants Butler in.

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/goldenea ... 11521.html

That also indicates a gag order regarding everything might be in affect.

True. My mistake. But they have been mentioned by everyone and their mother and even put out a "we're keeping our options open statement." Also, w/o Butler and/or X, the C7 are honestly no better than the A10, so Butler is a must, and X is a must. I wasn't snarking either. I have only ever heard 3 names on the lips of an official connected with the C7. Someone let me know if I missed other mentions!